I have been dating a guy from work for the last year (actually, a bit more). Let's call him P.
He is a bit older than me (8 years) and has two sons. From the very beginning he made cit lear that he didn't want a serious commitment. He has no intention to get married again, and so on. So, we had this tacit agreement that we would "date" each other as long as we were both happy with the situation. And from time to time, a bit serious, a bit joking, he'd say - I know one day you'll tell me "I like X more than I like you" and the only thing I can do is accept it and step aside. Probably because we have no idea where this relationship is going, we didn't make it "public".
Well, unfortunately I fell madly in love with this P. I have considered staying in this situation as long as it can last. I can say he really tries to be present in my life even when he's not phisically with me. He made it possible for me to meet his boys, without the need to introduce me as his "girlfriend". Seriously I never feel alone, I know he is there when/if I need him.
On the other side, he cannot always be with me when I'd like. So sometimes when I feel like doing something, and he can't come with me, I go with friends, either male or female. As an example - I went to a concert more than once with my friend C, went to art exhibitions with L, and so on. Sometimes I tell him, sometimes I don't, because I consider these guys just friends, and there is no reason to make him worried over something which doesn't exist.
Enter E. He is another colleague, and he will start working in the same shift as P in September. He is a nice guy, he might start playing in our group, and last week asked me if I wanted to go to the beach after work. Seriously, I did want to go to the beach. I enjoy E's company, so I said yes. Please note it was not my intention to tell P, for the same reasons I stated above.
On our way to the beach, we met another guy, B, with his wife and kids- who works with both P and E (I know, it's fate or something)!
So I decided this time I'd tell P because I didn't want B to come up, innocently, with something like - you know, last week I met E and ico going to the beach. (BTW - there is NOTHING between E and me!)
My first mistake was I sent him an email. I was afraid I wouldn't be able to explain face to face, but apparently I wasn't able to explain the situation by email either.
I would have never expected this to hit him so bad. He said this should make us think, because I probably went with E because I see him as potentially able to give me a relationship with more future than the one P can give me. He says he needs to think because in that moment he couldn't decide, or he was afraid to take the wrong decision. I think the fact that the person was E really got him.
I really didn't expect such a reaction.
E is younger, has no kids, and is good looking - so it's obvious that P sees him as a very dangerous "enemy".
Now, I have tried to explain P that for me nothing has changed: I still want to be with him. If it needs to be, I can stop accepting E's invitations to do whatever - I have no problems with that, even though I don't think it's completely fair. But I understand them working together might be a huge problem.
Plus, today he's leaving with the kids for a short vacation, and I am afraid he'll get stuck on the worst part of his thoughts and come back with a stupid decision. Yesterday night he sent me a text stating "I have to keep my self from saying stupid things". To which I replied to try to get unstuck and stay calm. He replied I am right, and later sent me the "goodnight beautiful" he often sends.
Now I really have nothing else to do than sit and wait. I am sorry I made this mess, and even more sorry I didn't talk to him face to face - but I have learnt my lesson and will never do it again.
Let me add a short note here - here in Italy the whole american concept of - "we are not exclusive until we decide to be" is pretty much unknown. Men are generally more jealous than in the US, and I am not talking about the pathological, destructive jealousy. Only, they think, if you are seeing me, you should be seeing me only. I have been in the US for too long to agree with that. I think some problems come form there.
Do you have any suggestions on how to clear this mess?
Deep down, I suspect you knew he wouldn't be supportive of your outing with E, am I right? Did you go out with E, thinking maybe it would give P something to worry about in regard to losing you and get him to think in a more committal fashion?
Well, P can't have his cake and eat it too. P has made it very clear he only views your relationship as temporary. I would ask him if he has changed his mind. It's not fair to tell you that he wants a temporary relationship and have expectations of you that would be applied to a committed relationship or string you along like it could be something more.
I would also ask him why he only wants something temporary. Is it that he knows up-front that you are not someone he could commit to? In my experience, guys that say this don't want a committed relationship with you ever. It's up to you to decide if that's OK with you to continue on knowing that.
I'm hoping he comes back saying he wants a more permanent relationship with you. Hopefully this is a wake up call for him.
If not, is that what you want to sign up for? A guy that is a good time temporarily until you meet the right one? If so, then there is no issue. If not, then settle for nothing less.
There's also something about the things we can't have. They're a challenge and we always want them more than if they were easily accessible.
Whatever situation you choose to accept is OK. You just have to be OK with what you choose to accept and not expect anything to be other than what it is.
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"Fashion can be bought. Style one must possess." ~ Edna Woolman Chase
D, everything you said is right, except that I did not want P to know about E - I had to tell him because I thought it'd be very ugly if he learnt that from someone else. So I didn't go with E trying to shake P up, it just happened.
As for the rest, yes, I have thought about this. Yes, his exaggerated reaction makes me think he could want something more. But I think I am not gonna wait forever for him to make up his mind.
I am going to have a very honest conversation with him when he's back. I am ok about keeping things as they are, but he must understand this also means things like me going to the beach with someone else can happen.
I think D covered it. You guys have been dating for almost a year. That should be more than enough time for him to decide if he wants a real, long term relationship with you. I'm sure it's something he has to really consider seriously since he's a father and seems like a good guy. But you shouldn't have to stay in limbo forever and you certainly shouldn't be made to feel like you have to jump through hoops for him. I think that you should be able to see who you want (especially platonicly!) and do what you want if you guys have agreed not to be exclusive. A year is about the right time for a "where are we?" sort of conversation, if only to get you both on the same page.
Given that he is the one who initiated the 'nothing too serious' vibe for the relationship, I cannot understand why he is upset that you spent time with another man - especially if it wasn't romantic! He can't have it both ways!
I think your plan of having a chat with him when he is back is a good one - sounds like everyone needs to be on the same page again.
One more thing to add. 15 years ago, when my boyfriend was looking for a house to buy and would make references to me having the walk in closet, etc., I needed to know if he wanted me to move in with him. At the time, I was planning a move to New York City. His response to me was "I don't know. I've already been through all of that and I don't want to do it again." I told him "But, I'm not her." It wasn't fair to apply what hadn't worked for him with someone else to me. I didn't change his mind, so I left him. He and I wanted different things, and I wasn't going to waste time with him when I could be available for someone who wanted what I wanted.
He ended up wanting to get back together and we moved moved in together. I told him I didn't want to live together indefinitely and that I wanted to be married, and I again heard the excuse "I don't know. I've already been through all of that and I don't want to do it again." It was up to me to make a choice. I loved him, but I wanted a life-partner that wouldn't be afraid to legally commit to me. I started looking for an apartment, etc. What he was serving up wasn't what I wanted, so I decided it was best for me to leave so I could again, be available for the right relationship.
He then decided that he didn't want to lose me in his life and that we could get married. I in no way gave him an ultimatum. I was simply choosing not to stay in a type of relationship I didn't want. He is now my husband of 14 years. I'm not saying that it's all been easy, but a good, strong marriage can overcome any challenge.
I guess what I'm saying is don't allow him to penalize you for his past failed relationships. I also wanted to share that sometimes losing someone you take for granted can be a wake up call. Yes, we all want prince charming to be head over heels with us and get down on one knee, etc. but relationships sans the fairy tale can be pretty darn good too.
I'm really hoping it's a wake up call for your guy. But if it's not, there is a silver lining in having the freedom to find what you want.
__________________
"Fashion can be bought. Style one must possess." ~ Edna Woolman Chase
Honestly a year is a long time to date someone and not call it a commitment. It looks like a commitment to me. You love him, does he love you?
I'm at a disadvantage because it's a foreign culture, but you don't have anything to feel guilty about, and it doesn't seem very messy. You went out with a friend at work. What gender he is and what he looks like shouldn't matter. Your boyfriend overreacted because of his many insecurities:
- He is older and worries that you will lose interest in him - He considers himself less attractive than other men you might meet - He has children and worries you might prefer someone without children - He is not emotionally available and he is afraid you will find someone who is.
But that's not *your* mess to worry about, it's *his* mess. The only way you can help is by petting his ego...and I'm not sure it's worth it.
Quick update - the guy is seriously freaking out. He sent me like 20 texts yesterday.
Now he is almost sure some things I did last week, like going to my parents' for dinner on Wed, were excuses to see the other guy. Then he says he's ruining my life because he doesn't have any rights to tie me down. I can only tell him to be calm for now and we'll discuss all this later.
On one side, I am really sorry he is taking this whole thing so bad. On the other side, I think he is the one who looked exactly for this. But I feel mean for thinking so.
Don't feel guilty. You aren't playing any games with him and have been very honest about your feelings and actions. The freak outs are his, not your's. Keep being honest and open and let him decide what the next step is.
Don't feel guilty. You aren't playing any games with him and have been very honest about your feelings and actions. The freak outs are his, not your's. Keep being honest and open and let him decide what the next step is.
I agree. He also needs to realize that this is the situation he expressed he wanted. He has no right to not trust you or make you feel guilty for making his desires reality (in a sense.)
It's almost like you should say to him, "E and I are not romantically involved and our only meeting was at the beach. Even if E and I were to become romantically involved, isn't this what you wanted? Isn't this what you perpared yourself for all this time?" Just seems ridiculous he's freaking out when this is exactly what he invisioned for your and his future. Maybe you should ask him if what he said all along about not wanting a committed relationship and that you'd find someone else was just a game?
Mr. Cake eater needs to wake up
-- Edited by D on Wednesday 17th of August 2011 11:27:06 AM
__________________
"Fashion can be bought. Style one must possess." ~ Edna Woolman Chase
Don't feel guilty. You aren't playing any games with him and have been very honest about your feelings and actions. The freak outs are his, not your's. Keep being honest and open and let him decide what the next step is.
I agree. He also needs to realize that this is the situation he expressed he wanted. He has no right to not trust you or make you feel guilty for making his desires reality (in a sense.)
It's almost like you should say to him, "E and I are not romantically involved and our only meeting was at the beach. Even if E and I were to become romantically involved, isn't this what you wanted? Isn't this what you perpared yourself for all this time?" Just seems ridiculous he's freaking out when this is exactly what he invisioned for your and his future. Maybe you should ask him if what he said all along about not wanting a committed relationship and that you'd find someone else was just a game?
Mr. Cake eater needs to wake up
-- Edited by D on Wednesday 17th of August 2011 11:27:06 AM
I am so going to call those type of people Cake Eaters now.l
I think his freak out might just be an excuse for him to bow out and blame you. He doesn't seem to want to be all in, but he also doesnt want to step out, and that is not fair to you. You need to ask yourself how long you want to stay in something that seemingly has no future. Sorry to be so blunt, but I feel like it's to easy to make excuses for him when your romantically attached...
Well, there is another update. I am just wandering why I can't have my nice quiet 3 days vacation with my cousin...
The other guy, E, has kept sending me a couple of texts a day since I left. And yesterday he called me and asked if I wanted to go out on Fri or Sat. I was very surprised I didn't have to think much before saying yes. At this point I think he might be interested in me, I am not sure what I think, but I haven't had many chances to talk to him outside work so I don't know him that well.
So I spent the evening with poor cousin, half complaining because P hasn't called me since Sun and feeling guilty for having said yes to E,, half trying to decide what I'll wear on Sat, until we met her friend for drinks and she got me drunk after taking my cell phone and keeping it under strict custody (I have smart relatives) - but that's another story.
The point is, I feel guilty about doing this to P, but at the same time I am tired of his complaints and I want to know E better. And I think I am a bad person...
Well, that certainly makes things interesting doesn't it? Don't feel guilty -- you're not in a committed relationship (yet.)
I started to speculate, then stopped myself, because at this point, things can work out fairly simply.
I think you should go out with E (good for you for not hesitating) and see what Mr. Cake Eater has to say. Who knows, you may have a choice to make, or no choice at all.
I'm glad you have your cousin with you -- I'm sure this would be far more difficult without her there with you!
__________________
"Fashion can be bought. Style one must possess." ~ Edna Woolman Chase
The notion that you are a bad person in nonsense - don't even think it. Just because Mr. Cake Eater is bingeing on cake right now doesn't mean that going out with E is a bad idea. Have fun and see what happens - no guilt!
Remember, it was his idea to be non-exculsive. Who knows, E could be the right guy for you. He could be the right guy for right now for you. Or he could just be a nice one time dinner date. You won't know until you get to know him better.
When you tell Mr. Cake Eater, let him know that your relationship with E, no mater what it is, is not a ploy by you to get him to commit. But also let him know that until he fugres out what he wants, you aren't putting your life on hold.