STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

lsubatgirl · Gucci

RE: I don't know how to deal...

nunzi182 · Kate Spade

JoceyBaby23 wrote:

laken1 wrote:
I have to agree - I don't see the point of him being there. Flying over to see the damage? sure, but they are evacuating EVERYONE - there are people standing on the bridges / interstate - there's really no where for him to be. Not to mention the reported gun fire in the places you can get to possibly by helicopter or something, looting, snakes, etc - it's really not safe. -- Edited by laken1 at 16:12, 2005-08-31

Laken1 is right.
And this post has me fired up!
I am a supporter of Bush, not because I am a die-hard republican but I do believe that he is our President and we, the people, should stand behind his decisions even if we don't completely agree with him all the time.
What exactly do you want him to do at this time? He is obviously in support of the Red Cross and I'm sure he is sending money and troops to help (if he hasnt already).
If he was flying over in a helicopter today, I think some people would probably criticize him for not climbing down on a rope and saving people himself. Which is ridiculous.. he is not trained to help these people BUT he is supporting and sending those people who can help.
He is a leader.. Leader of the free world.. It wouldnt look good if he came on TV crying over the tragedy. He is supposed to project an image of strength, hope and faith in the good of our nation. Not dwell on the bad things. He was not elected to get his hands dirty, but to direct, support and manage those who are involved everyday (like the Military)
All I really mean, is that people are too critical of the President. No matter how he handles issues, people will always hound him and attack him for not doing what they think he should be doing. I think some commentators just want something to complain about.
I hope noone takes this personally.. But I am very pro-American, and although I may not agree with everything Bush does, I think it makes American look weak when Americans hate the President.

Okay, I really can't stand Bush, but I do agree with you to a large extent. We should support the president unless he is doing something completely outrageous (along the lines of Hitler or something) and since I doubt that will happen, we probably should be supporting him.

However, it is America, and part of being American is allowing people to form their own opinions and ideas and being able to voice.

I also hope I did not offend any one.

Cricket · Gucci

I agree that it would be impossible for him to be down on the ground anywhere along the Gulf Coast right now. It is complete chaos there and to add the chaos that the president brings along with him would not be wise. Secret Service would have no way of securing any area he would "tour".

I do not believe he is taking the situation down there lightly. How could he? There is no way he is that callous. This is a huge disaster and I'm sure it is priority #1 in the White House right now. It has to be.

NCshopper · Hermes

I agree that I'm sure the president isn't taking this lightly. I don't like him at all, but I do believe he is concerned about the situation.

However, that being said, I don't think playing around on the guitar while major cities are flooding and people are drowning by the hundreds was a good PR move for him. He should be projecting an image of strength, seriousness, and resolve, not looking like he's goofing around and having a grand ole time. But I also agree that he has no business being in New Orleans right now either--it would just create more chaos.

A press conference or national address explaining how he planned to deal with the situation at hand would have been an appropriate move for him. Reassuring the people during a time of crisis is an important duty for any President, and I'm not sure he's done that here.

ILoveChoo · Hermes

NCshopper wrote:

I agree that I'm sure the president isn't taking this lightly. I don't like him at all, but I do believe he is concerned about the situation. However, that being said, I don't think playing around on the guitar while major cities are flooding and people are drowning by the hundreds was a good PR move for him. He should be projecting an image of strength, seriousness, and resolve, not looking like he's goofing around and having a grand ole time. But I also agree that he has no business being in New Orleans right now either--it would just create more chaos. A press conference or national address explaining how he planned to deal with the situation at hand would have been an appropriate move for him. Reassuring the people during a time of crisis is an important duty for any President, and I'm not sure he's done that here.

very well stated, and I agree with this. When I said he should be in La. I really didn't mean it seriously, I was just mad. He shoud be somewhere relevant to the situation (but safe, and yes that might be DC) looking like he is serious and telling us his plan...not playing a guitar. This is going to be the same PR nightmare for him as it was on 9/11 when he continued to read to the kids (again, not saying that he did the wrong thing- anything he did would have gotten ripped apart). It's a tough situation, but as president he should realize that there are certain time when he should not appear to simply be contining on with life as usual.

Claudia · Gucci

I totally agree with JoceyBaby.

laken1 · Hermes

He is giving a press conference right now

gruiz · Kenneth Cole

I usually try to stay out of political debates, but I'm not seeing the connection between him holding a guitar and having concern over Katrina's victims.

Wouldn't it have been just as strange to have this singer dude give the president a guitar and have George W. say "oh, no thanks, I can't take that. I'm too concerned about Katrina to accept your gift."

I don't like George W., I didn't vote for George W., but I don't think this photo makes him a bad person or president. He's playing a guitar. So what? Just because he's not personally dealing with victims at the moment doesn't mean he didn't direct OTHER people to help in his place. He's the boss. He delegates. He's allowed to play the guitar.

DC Shopper · Dooney & Bourke

I agree that the guitar thing has no bearing on Bush's feelings about the hurricane. Bad PR move, but I'm sure he's doing everything he can, and it's not really feasable for him to be flying into NO right now.

but i do want to say that just because you criticize the president doesn't mean you are not pro-American. I think political dissent strengthens America, when it is directed at policy issues. It's not right to ask people to suppress their opinions and beliefs just to present a "strong" front to the rest of the world.

Elle · Hermes

All I'm going to say is, he is a walking, talking PR NIGHTMARE!!!

Maddie · Coach

I completely agree with gruiz. I think deciding that because there's a picture of him smiling and playing guitar means he doesn't care about Katrina is a pretty simple way of looking at the situation. It's not as if he was putting on a concert for fun or anything, he was strumming a guitar that was handed to him.

I don't think he should really be doing anything differently. He came back from his vacation early (not that I think that was such a huge sacrifice or anything), and is giving a press conference. When he went to New York after 9/11 it was a totally different situation. Sure they are both national tragedies but that's about all they have in common. There is nothing he could do there now for the people and it would probably create even more chaos to have to deal with everything that goes along with a presidential visit. And if he was flying over New Orleans looking for survivors in a helicopter I personally wouldn't think that his heart was in it, I would think it was a PR stunt.

I'm not particularly pro-Bush, I didn't vote for him or anything, but I think it's way to easy to see some picture and blame Bush for everything. Liberals always accuse conservatives of coming to simple conclusions and believing whatever the media says, but I think this sort of attitude is just as bad.

sfcaligirl · Dooney & Bourke

DC Shopper wrote:

I agree that the guitar thing has no bearing on Bush's feelings about the hurricane. Bad PR move, but I'm sure he's doing everything he can, and it's not really feasable for him to be flying into NO right now. but i do want to say that just because you criticize the president doesn't mean you are not pro-American. I think political dissent strengthens America, when it is directed at policy issues. It's not right to ask people to suppress their opinions and beliefs just to present a "strong" front to the rest of the world.

i completely agree with everything you said, DC shopper. the guitar thing doesn't bother me so much- i highly doubt that he's not concerned about the devastation in LA. i also do not believe that it is my "patriotic duty" to support a president whose ideals are so vastly different than my own just because he was elected president. bush doesn't represent anything that i stand for and speaking out against him is my right/choice. (eta: i'm speaking generally here. i do not agree with bush on some big issues, such as abortion, the war in iraq, etc. i do believe he's doing what he can in this case- providing aid to hurricane victims.)

-- Edited by sfcaligirl at 18:24, 2005-08-31

ranchera20 · Marc Jacobs

I knew it was pretty hard for people to even get into NO so I'm not that upset even after hearing today that he did arrive to Louisianna about a couple of hours ago. He is the President so of course he HAS to do something. He can't just sit around all day and watch everything on the news.

theotherjess · Chanel

JoceyBaby23 wrote:

I am a supporter of Bush, not because I am a die-hard republican but I do believe that he is our President and we, the people, should stand behind his decisions even if we don't completely agree with him all the time.

Thank you for sharing this. Not to diss (for lack of a better word) blubirde or anyone else on here because I respect your opinions, but I think this is an attitude that is lacking in our country.

kenzie · Chanel

I'll just jump in again here. It's about time he does a press conference. I think it's a little late. Like LMonet said, the man is a PR disaster!

And as far as standing behind the President just b/c he's President, IMO, isn't the most 'American' of opinions. To just passively stand by and say that no matter what he does it's okay and I support him b/c he's President, completely undermines the American ideal- free thinking, independence and personal rights and freedoms. It almost has notes of a dictatorship mindset. I don't care who the President is, whether I voted for him or not, I will not always agree with everything that he does simply b/c he holds the presidential office. I will not be brainwashed, told what to think, stiffle my opinions and simply smile, nod and shrug my shoulders just b/c I'm supporting the President and it is the American thing to do.

-- Edited by NylaBelle at 18:47, 2005-08-31

-- Edited by NylaBelle at 18:48, 2005-08-31

sfcaligirl · Dooney & Bourke

theotherjess wrote:

JoceyBaby23 wrote: I am a supporter of Bush, not because I am a die-hard republican but I do believe that he is our President and we, the people, should stand behind his decisions even if we don't completely agree with him all the time. Thank you for sharing this. Not to diss (for lack of a better word) blubirde or anyone else on here because I respect your opinions, but I think this is an attitude that is lacking in our country.

i don't agree that the "support the president" attitude is lacking in our country. i think it was one of the driving forces that got bush reelected! there were many, many people (including some swing voters) who voted for him simply because they were afraid to "rock the boat" and switch presidents during wartime. a lot of those voters didn't even support the war in the first place.

i think that blindly supporting the president is much more dangerous to our country than expressing dissent. it is imperative to hold the president/government accountable. (i'm not implying that anybody here in particular is "blindly supporting" bush, but i think some people do that without really thinking about how they truly feel about certain issues. i'm not trying to offend anyone here!)

kenzie · Chanel

sfcaligirl wrote:

i'm not trying to offend anyone here!

I don't think that anyone is trying offend anyone else. I don't take offense when someone's opinion differs from mine (not that yours did, I'm just saying). I like that we can come to this forum and debate topics, but at the end of the day, I still like everyone here and feel a sense of community.

dc · Dooney & Bourke

Just want to respond to a few general remarks, as I completely and respectfully disagree. My answers here are general, not even about this specific situation except where noted, and not not not an attack on Jocey, just a response to those general sentiments (shared by several others here) I bolded. So please don't take this as a personal attack or response - it's not.

a) "I do believe that he is our President and we, the people, should stand behind his decisions even if we don't completely agree with him all the time."

No, we should not support decisions we don't agree with (and in this case, what exactly would we be supporting?) This is America, not the Soviet Union, and the only way to affect change is to speak truth to power. Always question authority, no matter what your party. Corruption exists, dissent exists, leaders are human, and so are we. Also, the President is not absolute leader - this is not a dictatorship. A number of different people in our govt. represent different viewpoints or there would be no need for different political parties. Debate is HEALTHY and right. And why should I support a yahoo I didn't vote for and, frankly, am suspicious of? Now that would be un-American of me. And I don't believe in positive reinforcement for bad behavior - I wouldn't do it for my baby nephew and I sure as hell wouldn't for my President. Leaders must be held accountable and set an example.

b) "Leader of the free world.. It wouldnt look good if he came on TV crying over the tragedy."

It also doesn't look good for the "leader of the free world" to come on TV strumming a guitar and yukking it up while New Orleans floods to the brim and Gulfport is basically gone. Shades of Nero playing the fiddle while Rome burned. It is simply in bad taste - a photo op he should have skipped. And I do think it's kinda lame that we waits 3 days post-disaster to cut his mammoth 5-week vacation 2 days short.

c) "He was not elected to get his hands dirty,"

Yes, being the "leader of the free world" does entail getting ones' hands dirty - perhaps not literally, but symbolically at least. I actually *would* like to see him speak some words of encouragement to, say, the refugees in the superdome (as he did to the workers at ground zero) or at least go to one of the states involved to meet with local leaders. He doesn't ahve to wade throguh flood wters, but you'd think the guy who takes such enormous (and rather distasteful, IMO) pleasure in calling himself "A Wartime President" would seize a moment like this... if not just for a photo op or sound bite. He is facing the lowest numbers of his presidency here, and there is good reason for that.

d) "All I really mean, is that people are too critical of the President."

No such thing as being "too critical" of the President. This man's actions are what the rest of the world sees, and it affects our lives & safety (especially those of us who live 5 blocks from him). This is not how I want my country run or represented, sorry. I am not just looknig for something to complain about. I don't enjoy it. Too bad he gives me so much material. I fear for my life with this dude in charge, thus I complain. So sue me.

e) But I am very pro-American, and although I may not agree with everything Bush does, I think it makes American look weak when Americans hate the President.

All of the above does not make me anti-American. (I hate even the notion of "pro" or "anti." We're all citizens here, we all want our country to be the best it can be. "Pro" or "Anti" makes everything sound so "you're with us or against us" and the world is not so simple.) It does not make us look weak to dissent - people in other countries respect it. Did the citizens of Ukraine "look weak" when they protested their last election? No - they looked just the opposite: strong and not about to deal with corrupt bullshit. But here... heaven forbid! People just tell you to shut up and quit whining rather than face up to problems. It is more important to appear united than to actually FIX a wrongdoing. That, to me, is shameful. Taking responsibility and encouraging healthy debate is not. People abroad RESPECT political discourse - in other countries, people debate politics on the street with strangers, intellectuals are respected, and everyday citizens show up in droves to protest or express an opinion. Here, the mainstream (not necessarily anyone here) dismisses protestors as wingnuts, regards interpersonal debate about politics or religion as impolite, prizes strength over intelligence, and talk about supporting leaders they may not even agree with.

Sorry... got sort of worked up. It's not because I am a "liberal" - it's because I am unable not to think & question. I simply feel we have too much at stake in today's world to blindly trust.

-- Edited by dc at 19:17, 2005-08-31

sfcaligirl · Dooney & Bourke

NylaBelle wrote:

sfcaligirl wrote: i'm not trying to offend anyone here! I don't think that anyone is trying offend anyone else. I don't take offense when someone's opinion differs from mine (not that yours did, I'm just saying). I like that we can come to this forum and debate topics, but at the end of the day, I still like everyone here and feel a sense of community.

i agree, nobody is trying to offend anybody, but political discussions can get heated. i just wanted to make sure that the person i was responding to knew that i was speaking more generally and not directing my comments at her.

lsubatgirl · Gucci

Just for the record he did come out and speak up about the hurricane and relief efforts both before and after the hurricane hit. It just wasn't a national press conference. He signed the emergency relief for Fema to come in over the weekend before the hurricane hit.