STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

ShanKel · Kenneth Cole

Is cheating an absolute dealbreaker?

ejc423 · Coach

Oh I am SO glad your poor friend has you as a friend!

It makes me so sad to hear about her "out of sight out of mind attitude". I really hope she figures out that she deserves to have a man who doesn't cheat and she should NOT put up with one who does. It's just not healthy--emotionally or physically. The fact that she knows he is cheating, is hurt by it, but is looking the other way when he does it is a HUGE red flag that this girl has serious self-worth issues.

ShanKel, you are not crazy. Cheating IS a serious issue. Ugh, I hope your friend quits that man!

Kel · Coach

I really don't have time to reply but i wanted to say this: That not all men cheat, it is not in this innate characteristics. I think that is just stupid. Yeah a lot of guys do cheat. And it defintely sounds like he is one of them. Especially since he is trying to turn the tables on her and get mad at her for looking at the bill. If i were her I would not put up with that, why do you want to be with a man who does not repect you.

JoceyBaby23 · Gucci

Cheating is a huge dealbreaker. I personally don't care about the circumstances.. too drunk, the gf/wife has changed.. gotten fat.. whatever.. It is unacceptable and me and I would never tolerate it. There are too many girls out there that become total pushovers and they just get used to being treated badly and accept it as life.. or its just men in general. I used to be that way with an ex.. now that im with someone real and honest and true to me. That has made me completely change my old way of thinking.

honey · Gucci

*please don't run me off the board for this* but i voted depends. i said this b/c cheating is one of those things where you never know how you are going to react until it happens to you. when it happens to you there are lots of things that influence your final decision to stay or leave, that you don't think about when it's just an abstract concept.

that being said your friend needs to LEAVE her fh right now. it's not an isolated incident but clearly a pattern that he has developed and plans on continuing, and that is unacceptable.

lsubatgirl · Gucci

I agree with what honey said. I voted yes in this situation but overall I think it depends only because I made the mistake one night of kissing another guy but nothing else. It was a one time thing and I had been fighting with the bf for a while. In that situation we took a break and worked on our issues then got back together.

In this situation she needs to wake up and leave. He is with 3 different girls besides her and its been going on for a while! He isn't going to change. He might get even worse. I'd just keep telling her that not all guys do this, its not normal, and she can do better - not to settle for him!

blubirde · Chanel

I cannot BELIEVE other women in your friend's life are telling her that all men cheat and to just get over it. I would never, in a million years, tell another female something like that.

All men DO NOT cheat. What a load of shit! It will be a cold day in hell before I am not outraged at the thought of cheating.

Your friend needs to wake up and deal with her feelings. It's definitely a lot easier to turn a blind eye, but at what cost? Her mental stability? Her self-esteem? She's acting like a royal idiot and if she were my friend I'd be the first one in her face, shaking her.

All that said, I would never advocate ending a relationship over cheating. (I don't mean I wouldn't do it myself or that a person shouldn't do it - it's just such a personal decision that I can't argue one way or another because it's not my cross, ya know?) I, personally, could not stay in a relationship where an affair had been going on. Matters of the body are one thing but matters of the heart are a completely different thing. I'm not sure I could stay in a relationship at all where any kind of cheating had gone on, drunken night, ex-girlfriend, stripper, whatever. But I can understand how some people can work through mistakes and come out stronger because of it. (That's why I answered depends on the poll.)

All in all, your friend needs to wake up and deal with the reality of the situation. If she still wants to work on her relationship with her FH then they have A LOT of work to do to come through this, and the first step is admitting the truth. Trust is so strong and so fragile, all at the same time, but it's essential to a happy relationship, be it friend, family, or lover. She's lucky to have you as a friend and I think you can help her help herself by not letting her stick her head in the sand.

Elle · Hermes

NOT ALL MEN CHEAT. THIS PARTICULAR ONE IS A PIG. YOUR FRIEND NEEDS TO KICK HIS A$$ OUT AND NEVER LOOK BACK!

I agree with Honey too - there are many variables in such a situation. But I do feel that anyone who has been cheated on has a god-given right to leave with no questions asked completely regardless of those variables. For the record, I would never even consider forgiving cheating-for-a-year-with-more-than-one-woman-then-lying-about-it guy! Confused-and-kissed-one-girl-one-time-and-feels-terrible-about-it guy I might be a little more sympathetic toward. Any kind of second-strike though and that dude would be gone sooooo fast . . . .

The 'but I still love him' thing is a bunch of bull - I've heard so many cheated-on girls use it. They might still love the guy they thought he was, but clearly if they are in such a situation in the first place then they have been seriously mislead about him as a person.

Maddie · Coach

I voted that it depends. I think cheating can be forgiven, depending on the situation. I don't think that your friend's situation is one of those and I would never put up with that.

crystal · Kate Spade

your friend is lucky she has you cuz when this guy finally breaks up w/ her (which he will), she'll have u to fall back on. i've cheated before (in college, who can help it??) and although i thought i wanted to stay in my relationship i either ended up getting dumped, or i ended up doing the dumping and now i wouldn't want to be w/ either of the guys i cheated on. when u are happy in a relationship it doesn't matter the situation, u wouldn't cheat because u do not want to hurt ur partner. i've been in several relationships since my cheating days and did not cheat in any way, so i wouldn't say "once a cheater always a cheater" really applies. good luck to u & especially to ur friend!

blubirde · Chanel

quote:
Originally posted by: crystal
"i've been in several relationships since my cheating days and did not cheat in any way, so i wouldn't say "once a cheater always a cheater" really applies."

Not when your experiences were in college anyway. That doesn't really count because we're all too busy trying to develop our principles and figure out which way is up. That's your only freebie. After that, I think the "always a cheater" rule applies most of the time - although not all.

KE · Kenneth Cole

She absolutely needs to lose this guy - He is and will continue to be a nightmare. Show your friends all these responses- what those other women are telling her is *wrong*

Andrea Julia · Coach

I voted yes. I just couldn't be with someone after they cheated. I know this for a fact, no matter what the situation is, how long we've been together, how many children we have, etc., I would not stay with a cheater. I know I could never, ever look at our relationship the same afterward. In addition to not being able to deal with the deceit, I would HATE the idea of people outside the relationship seeing us as a weak couple. I think that is why a lot of times cheating will occur again-people don't take you as a couple quite so seriously anymore.

The only way I can see being with someone who has cheated on me is if a lot of time went by. If I had a boyfriend 5 years ago and he cheated on me, I might be willling to give it another go now. People change and maybe it was bad timing for us earlier in life. It would be like a new relationship after that long. I don't necessarily believe in "once a cheat, always a cheat," but I do believe you are more likely to cheat in your current relationship if you have before.

-- Edited by Andrea Julia at 13:10, 2005-04-06

sfcaligirl · Dooney & Bourke

quote:
Originally posted by: Andrea Julia
"I voted yes. I just couldn't be with someone after they cheated. I know this for a fact, no matter what the situation is, how long we've been together, how many children we have, etc., I would not stay with a cheater. I know I could never, ever look at our relationship the same afterward."

i completely agree with AJ on this one. there is absolutely no way that i could stay with a person who deceived me. i have always said about relationships, "once trust is gone, there's nothing."

Dizzy · Marc Jacobs

I voted "depends" because I know some great people who have cheated. And people are good and bad. Sometimes they screw up. But um, I don't think it's normal to screw up for at least a year with three different people. That's just poor character.

Don't judge your friend, though. My ex cheated on me and I put up with it for at least eight months. Sometimes it's really hard to admit to something that's going to rip your heart apart. Your friend might be in the same boat. She sort of suspects, but also believes she could be crazy for being suspicious. When you love someone, you really want to believe and trust what they say. So as long as she never catches him directly, or he never admits it (and the chronic cheaters never do) she'll probably want to hang on and hope it's just her problem.

Oh, and your friend's fake friends really aren't that unusual. I think sometimes people get invested in other people's relationships. I know when I tried to talk to my friends about this, they were just like "There's no way he'd cheat on you..." and change the subject. No support. I don't think it's that uncommon in the kind of social circles where having a man is really important.

-- Edited by Dizzy at 14:53, 2005-04-06

ILoveChoo · Hermes

if it were a one time thing, it would depend but in a situation like that where it has obviously been something going on for a while and a whole other relationship has formed it should def. be a dealbreaker.

People make mistakes. But not every day for 2 hours.

bumblebee · Dooney & Bourke

i agree with the others: it depends on the circumstances, but this guy seems to have burned up any benefit of the doubt he may once have had. like lmonet said, if it were a guy who really screwed up once and felt bad about it and confessed it and wanted to work on the relationship, that's one thing.

but it's quite another thing to cheat with three different girls over a period of a year and lie and be defensive about it when caught (although his blatant disregard by using their shared cell phone account shows to me that he is just throwing it in her face at this point because he thinks he has her so snowed that there's no way she'll ever leave).

ShanKel · Kenneth Cole

Thanks everyone for making me feel like i'm not the minority here. I had a cheating boyfriend of 5 yrs and have been single ever since. i was just a little worried that this is what i have to look forward to. I agree with bluebird that she does have some major self esteem issues after talking to her at lunch today. I tried to gradually bring things up like, everyone is responsible for the choices they make and if she really wants to make a go at this, maybe they should go and talk to somebody before they get married next year.

I think another problem is that they have been together since jr year in high school, went to the same college and neither of them have expereinced other relationships. I think this is important especially for guys so i suggested that sometimes we just need to let people go and spread their wings before taking on the very serious issue of marriage. If it was meant to be, he'll resurface. She was totally defensive saying that its not an issue anymore, she completely trusts him and doesnt feel the need to go arouund snooping for more info. I took my cue to stop there. She definitely isnt ready to let this relationship go or even face it but i guess everyone needs to make their own mistakes, i know i definitely have. Its just so hard to see someone you care about being so clueless.

I was reading an article in a mag about cheating men recently and the author said that sometimes men will allow themselves to get caught because they are scared to end things or dont want to take the relationship to that next step. I immediately thought of my friend. things that make you go hmmm.....its not like he exactly proposed to her, it was more like an agreement.

lilmissdiva · Kenneth Cole

What it all comes down to is a matter of respect and trust. Does he respect her by cheating on her? No.

Will she trust him when he walks out the door or the next time his phone rings and he doesn't answer it. No.

Enough said. Life is too short and there are too many people in this world who will treat you with respect and dignity to put up with being 2nd best in someone's life.

blubirde · Chanel

quote:
Originally posted by: ShanKel
"Thanks everyone for making me feel like i'm not the minority here. I had a cheating boyfriend of 5 yrs and have been single ever since..."

Me, too! I had a bf of 4 years and he never slept with someone else but he definitely cheated. (It's like porn - you know it when you see it.) I forgave him but we had to work through a lot to gain trust back, and I'm not sure it was ever fully regained. As a result, I had a lot to deal with when I did finally break up with him. I had to deal with myself and the choices I'd made while I was in a relationship, which is really the hardest thing to confront. It's easy to point out when a significant other is f'ing up, but it's waay more difficult to look at yourself that hard in the mirror. And that's essentially what your friend is refusing to do. She's refusing to admit she might have made a bad decision over the years by staying with him or admit that she still has a lot of growing to do as a person before she can commit fully to another. Whatever the case, she's making a big mistake. Not necessarily by staying with him but by refusing to acknowledge the truth of the situation, whatever it may be. I feel sorry for her, but she's lucky to have a friend like you who can be there for her when her world comes crumbling down around her - because it will. It's really nice of you to care so much about her!

The thing about advice is that you can give it until you're blue in the face. You just can't make a person take it.