STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

Harry Potter! (spoilers, obviously)

dangergirl · Kate Spade

i thought it was good, i'm not sure what i think of the bit at the end though. i am probably being a bit thick, but i was a bit confused about why harry didn't die when he killed voldemort?!

Alikat · Kate Spade

I liked it! I was worried what it would be like after the last book which left me feeling a bit empty. I feel like she tied up the loose ends.

However, I agree the epilogue was a bit much for me. I felt like it was for JK Rowling more than anyone else. I mean, I want to know what happened to everyone else in the aftermath besides those four!

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

Alikat wrote:
I felt like it was for JK Rowling more than anyone else.

i agree--good point!

blubirde · Chanel

I had some really negative feelings to work through when I was done with HP. It sounds completely absurd but I just love the books so much it was hard to read the last one. That said, I'm re-reading it and loving it. It's much better the 2nd time around when I can devote much more time to it and am not so concerned about seeing what happens.

As for the prologue, I liked that there was something after the end. I don't really like to think of Harry as an adult with kids but I suppose it doesn't really matter. It's nice to know he's happy and he's still friends with Ron and Hermione.

I take HP waaaayyyy too seriously.

CarrieS · Marc Jacobs

I have to admit I'm a little sad that the series has ended. I don't feel that anything in this last book was a total shock though; Book 6 shocked me waaaaaaay more when they killed off Dumbledore. I kind of had a feeling that she wouldn't really kill off her main character in 7 though, although my mouth did drop open for a few minutes when Voldemort "killed" him in the forest. I also hadn't felt that Ron or Hermoine would die either.

Overall it was a good book and I'm glad she answered a lot of the unanswered questions finally!

valenciana · Dooney & Bourke

I really liked it...this book added so much complexity to some of the characters and subplots that was really sort of unexpected to me (Dudley & Petunia...Dumbledore's past), and I enjoyed that a lot. I wasn't completely shocked by all the events, and I was always (well, okay, I may have had my weak moments when I doubted it, but...) quite sure Harry, Ron and Hermione were gonna be okay, but I still liked the way the story unfolded.

At first I loved the epilogue, because it's exactly what I hoped for but feared wouldn't happen once most of those four were dead, but then I was annoyed at how pat it was. (And also, I mean, is Harry an Auror or what? What fantastic things has Hermione achieved besides popping out less oddly-named kids than Ginny (although, really, Hugo? What was wrong with the name Fred? But I digress...)) But then...I was discussing (read: having an HP nerd fest) with a girl in my class today, and realized that it all sort of makes sense. From the very first book and the Mirror of Erised, we've known that all Harry really wants is a family. Everyone he considered a sort of surrogate parent died (Sirius, Dumbledore, even Lupin). The only people left he thought of as "family" were Ron and Hermione, and finally, they truly became his family. And he was able to have children and enjoy them and give them the family he always wanted himself. I may get teary again...

alert

Also, how awesome was Mrs. Weasley at the end???

relrel · Marc Jacobs

Hmm. I was actually quite disappointed in the entire book. I hate to be such a spoilsport, but JKR just isn't a terribly good writer and this book really shows it. Like CarrieS, nothing was really shocking. I was actually hoping for Ron to have gone over to the Death Eaters when he left because that would have been much better than how it turned out. The whole thing was way too pat and happy for me. Yes, blah blah blah love and family.

I'm sitting here and really struggling with my feelings for this book. I really want to like it as I have enjoyed reading the series. But I remember back years ago when I picked up the first HP book and after about a chapter put it back down. This was way way back before it was really talked about, back when it was still simply a young adult/children's book. I thought the author wasn't terribly good or interesting and while the series had its moments (Dumbledore dying did actually have me cry a little) overall, I don't think the fuss was all worth it.

I think that there way too many gaps in JKR's writing to qualify it as good. Her imagination is fantastic, but her writing leaves something to be desired. For instance...when everybody is in Hogwart's and thinks Harry is dead. He was in Hagrid's arms, who carried him in and then all of a sudden he's not and he's under the Invisibility Cloak. I had to go back and reread that quite a few times. Where/when did he put the cloak on? You just can't leave something like that out. If anybody can find the sentence where it says "and Hagrid put him down and Harry pulled his cloak over his shoulders" that would be fantastic. (ETA: I went back and found out where Hagrid put him down...but no explanation as to the cloak).

And Crabbe (or was it Croyle)? Come on...you have to explain that sorta thing. You just can't go "and la te da, Crabbe/Croyle discovered that he was a good or half-good person and everything was shiny and happy". I can totally get Draco's mother and father caring more about thier son that Voldemort...but where does Crabbe/Croyle develop those feelings? Also, in the horrid epilogue, Draco almost seems to be a decent person- still a snob, but a decent snob.

And the wierd heaven/train station thing? And the wierd flayed child? Is that supposed to be part of Voldemort's soul? WTF? Totally not necessary. It was a good conversation between Dumbledore and Harry...the wierd child in the background wasn't needed.

I think my negative feelings stem mostly from the fact that a good majority of what I read is fantasy fiction, of which there are much better authors and stories. I think partly the problem is that JKR was still writing a young adult novel for a large audience and hence couldn't bog the reader down in tons of character or story development. I'm trying very hard to separate my reading of the books from the movies and I think without such wonderful actors in the movies the books wouldn't seem as exciting or real. JKR's character development in this last book was pitiful. Everything happened as it was supposed to happen and that just doesn't make for a good book. You can really feel her struggling to finish this book and finish the series.

All in all, I find it slightly offensive that JKR let all the main characters live, Harry, Hermione, Ron, and Ginny. That's just too sweet for me. It might have been that final epilogue that pushed me over the edge though. That was just simply awful. A nice short about about Harry and Ginny finally getting together would have been fine. I sort of felt like that last bit was crammed down my throat. It seriously was way to saccharine for me to stomach. Just one kid going off to Hogwart's would have done nicely-- not five or nine or twelve...all of which had such sweet nice well-thought out and meaningful names. Please.

I'm done bitching now. It was a good read- but overall I am much disappointed with JKR as an author and story-teller.

ETA: I've done more thinking. I just wanted to say that the last three (Prisoner of Azkaban, Order of Phoenix, Half-Blood Prince) were much better written and I did greatly enjoy those. So don't hate me. blankstare

I'm gonna attempt to read it again and see how I feel about it. I did just read the entire book in about six hours so I might have glossed over some important pieces.

-- Edited by relrel at 00:42, 2007-07-24

-- Edited by relrel at 01:00, 2007-07-24

Bastet · Kate Spade

I think that JKR wrote the epilogue a long time ago. I read somewhere that she'd written the end of the series years ago and had it locked up in her safety deposit box. I could tell that the epilogue wasn't written as well as the rest of the book, which leads me to believe that it was written years ago, since her writing has improved over the years. (Plus, what happened to Luna? I wanted to know how her life turned out!)

I was sad that Dobby died, I really liked him. I suspected that at least one Weasley was going to die, I figured it would be Ron or Mr. Weasley. I knew she was going to kill a lot of characters off when Hedwig died in the first few chapters. I'm happy that Mrs. Weasley was the one who killed Bellatrix. Originally, I wanted it to be Neville, so he could avenge his parents, but I think Molly doing it was more appropriate after what happened to her family.

Overall, I thought it was a good ending to the series. I'm happy that Harry didn't die, and I'm happy that Snape turned out to be good in the end.

squishy · Coach

Alikat wrote:
However, I agree the epilogue was a bit much for me. I felt like it was for JK Rowling more than anyone else. I mean, I want to know what happened to everyone else in the aftermath besides those four!

i remember reading that she was annoyed with fanfic, and the thought of someone else bastardizing the HP series by continuing it (by subsequent novels, movies, saturday morning cartoons etc) freaked her out. maybe this was her attempt to prevent that?

knshdion · BCBG

I'm still on the fence about the book. It was good, but definitely a little anticlimatic. I also read it kind of fast so I think that a re-read is in order. On the whole, i was disappointed with the pace of the book and I think that was partly due to the fact that there was this attempt to tie up all of the loose ends. I think that some loose ends needed to be tied up, but some could have been left open (not in a Sopranos kind of way). I alsom think the epilogue was slighty cringe-worthy. I must say that I was impressed with some of the little things from earlier books that were brought back in this one. Think that JKR was trying to please everyone with this one, instead of writing it exactly as she wanted the story to go so it moved in too many directions-Harry growing up, Harry v. Voldemort, Harry v. his doubt of Dumbledore, Harry and Ginny, etc. All of those things were crucial plot points that needed to be resolved, but it seemed like she took different paths to resolve them and instead of making the story dynamic and riveting, it seemed to pull the narative apart and make it somewhat disjointed. On the whole, I think that HP series was fantastic and the final book was a solid ending and you have to give JKR a lot of credit for not dragging on a series that could have supported serval more books.

emery · BCBG

I lied the book, but I thought it was sad to be reading the last one in the series. I have to admit that from The Hogwarts adventure on, it was a bit confusing, I agree with relrel that JKR isn't the author of the century, but those vary famous contemporary authors rarely are (Dan Brown? Steven King?). I am an elementary school teacher, so I have appreciation for it on a whole different level. I thought this book, and book 6 were the best page-turners. Overall, I thought the epilogue was a bit strange and did not sem to flow, and I wish JKR would have been a bit more broad on her update of characters, but, I must admit I was glad the update was there, because I would have wondered. I really thought Harry was going to die, but I am glad he didn't

blubirde · Chanel

relrel wrote:

Hmm. I was actually quite disappointed in the entire book. I hate to be such a spoilsport, but JKR just isn't a terribly good writer and this book really shows it. Like CarrieS, nothing was really shocking. I was actually hoping for Ron to have gone over to the Death Eaters when he left because that would have been much better than how it turned out. The whole thing was way too pat and happy for me. Yes, blah blah blah love and family.

I'm sitting here and really struggling with my feelings for this book. I really want to like it as I have enjoyed reading the series. But I remember back years ago when I picked up the first HP book and after about a chapter put it back down. This was way way back before it was really talked about, back when it was still simply a young adult/children's book. I thought the author wasn't terribly good or interesting and while the series had its moments (Dumbledore dying did actually have me cry a little) overall, I don't think the fuss was all worth it.

I think that there way too many gaps in JKR's writing to qualify it as good. Her imagination is fantastic, but her writing leaves something to be desired. For instance...when everybody is in Hogwart's and thinks Harry is dead. He was in Hagrid's arms, who carried him in and then all of a sudden he's not and he's under the Invisibility Cloak. I had to go back and reread that quite a few times. Where/when did he put the cloak on? You just can't leave something like that out. If anybody can find the sentence where it says "and Hagrid put him down and Harry pulled his cloak over his shoulders" that would be fantastic. (ETA: I went back and found out where Hagrid put him down...but no explanation as to the cloak).

And Crabbe (or was it Croyle)? Come on...you have to explain that sorta thing. You just can't go "and la te da, Crabbe/Croyle discovered that he was a good or half-good person and everything was shiny and happy". I can totally get Draco's mother and father caring more about thier son that Voldemort...but where does Crabbe/Croyle develop those feelings? Also, in the horrid epilogue, Draco almost seems to be a decent person- still a snob, but a decent snob.

And the wierd heaven/train station thing? And the wierd flayed child? Is that supposed to be part of Voldemort's soul? WTF? Totally not necessary. It was a good conversation between Dumbledore and Harry...the wierd child in the background wasn't needed.

I think my negative feelings stem mostly from the fact that a good majority of what I read is fantasy fiction, of which there are much better authors and stories. I think partly the problem is that JKR was still writing a young adult novel for a large audience and hence couldn't bog the reader down in tons of character or story development. I'm trying very hard to separate my reading of the books from the movies and I think without such wonderful actors in the movies the books wouldn't seem as exciting or real. JKR's character development in this last book was pitiful. Everything happened as it was supposed to happen and that just doesn't make for a good book. You can really feel her struggling to finish this book and finish the series.

All in all, I find it slightly offensive that JKR let all the main characters live, Harry, Hermione, Ron, and Ginny. That's just too sweet for me. It might have been that final epilogue that pushed me over the edge though. That was just simply awful. A nice short about about Harry and Ginny finally getting together would have been fine. I sort of felt like that last bit was crammed down my throat. It seriously was way to saccharine for me to stomach. Just one kid going off to Hogwart's would have done nicely-- not five or nine or twelve...all of which had such sweet nice well-thought out and meaningful names. Please.

I'm done bitching now. It was a good read- but overall I am much disappointed with JKR as an author and story-teller.

ETA: I've done more thinking. I just wanted to say that the last three (Prisoner of Azkaban, Order of Phoenix, Half-Blood Prince) were much better written and I did greatly enjoy those. So don't hate me. I'm gonna attempt to read it again and see how I feel about it. I did just read the entire book in about six hours so I might have glossed over some important pieces.

-- Edited by relrel at 00:42, 2007-07-24

-- Edited by relrel at 01:00, 2007-07-24

I have to disagree with you about what kind of author JK is. I have no idea if the HP books will go down in history as great literature, but she's an excellent author, especially in the world of children's lit. I first heard of JK and HP in college, in a 19th Century Brit Lit class. My prof couldn't stop going on and on about how amazing HP was and how it would go down in history as great children's lit, etc., etc., etc. I've also read many critical essays comparing JK to great authors, namely Lewis Carroll, and it's no secret her books are filled with references to classic literature.

That said, I think certain books are better than others, of course. I think history will further define which are the best, and I'm not at all sure Book 7 will be one of them. But I don't think you give her enough credit. She created the HP world, the story, and made it interesting enough that the whole world (I exaggerate) wanted to read it.

As for the invisibility cloak bit you're looking for, try page 733.

relrel · Marc Jacobs

blubirde wrote:

relrel wrote:

Lots and lots of snarky comments go here...erased cause was too long.

-- Edited by relrel at 00:42, 2007-07-24

-- Edited by relrel at 01:00, 2007-07-24

I have to disagree with you about what kind of author JK is. I have no idea if the HP books will go down in history as great literature, but she's an excellent author, especially in the world of children's lit. I first heard of JK and HP in college, in a 19th Century Brit Lit class. My prof couldn't stop going on and on about how amazing HP was and how it would go down in history as great children's lit, etc., etc., etc. I've also read many critical essays comparing JK to great authors, namely Lewis Carroll, and it's no secret her books are filled with references to classic literature.

That said, I think certain books are better than others, of course. I think history will further define which are the best, and I'm not at all sure Book 7 will be one of them. But I don't think you give her enough credit. She created the HP world, the story, and made it interesting enough that the whole world (I exaggerate) wanted to read it.

As for the invisibility cloak bit you're looking for, try page 733.

Thank you...that part with the cloak really clouded my judgement. As, or course, reading it in less than seven hours probably played a part in that.

I'm not trying to disparage JKR's place in history. She will probably go down in history as a great author. I just think that perhaps the media hype will end up playing a large part of that. I just don't think, IM(very)HO, that she can compare with Philip Pullman or Eoin Colfer or Christopher Paolini who write in the same genre of her.

Unfortunately, I don't think that she had terribly much to do with making the whole world want to read the book. Yes, the world of HP is a fantastically imagined world but it's a series that came along at a time when fantasty fiction was beginning to get respect from a wider audience. The media helped, I think, in a very large way to ensure her audience.

I actually find it quite distressing to hear her compared to such huge authors in the past. It's really upsetting because I feel that a lot of that sort of comparison is simply based on the fact that she writes in a certain type of genre and it's not a popular genre so it's easy to hold her up to such standards as Lewis Carroll. Does that make sense? I honestly don't think that the population as a whole (including book reviewers) have read enough fantasy fiction to make a fair judgement. Her books will go down as fantastic writing for a popular series, but probably not within the field of fantasy fiction. I just can't see her in fifty years becoming as revered as Tolkien or CS Lewis.

I hate to harp on this over and over again, but fantasy fiction is a genre very near and dear to my heart. It's, IMO, one of the hardest genre's to write in because you have to invent worlds with long historys and often other animals/humans/gods along with just basic character and plotline development. I don't think the average reader is prepared for that sort of book- there's a reason FF books are usually at least trilogies. I'm not calling you average (in fact...I think you're one of the smartest people around!) or anybody else on here average...but I am using the collective American population to base my very biased and cranky opinion.

nunzi182 · Kate Spade

I just finished reading this and I think it was the worst book out of the seven. I'm not saying it was bad, but I don't think it got really good until about page 450 or so. I think the book could have been a lot shorter. I was really sad when Dobby died and I was shocked that Snape was good all along. I thought that was a really good twist to the story.

As far ask JKR being one of the great writers of all time. I think you have to keep in mind that these books were written for children/young adults, not adults, and you can't really compare it to Lewis Carroll or any other greats because it's not on the same level. As far as children/young adult authors go, I think she is one of the greats and will be remembered in 50 years (if not for her writing skills then maybe for the fact that she became the richest woman next to Oprah, that's got to count for something, no?)

Oh yeah, and the epilogue was way too much.

NCshopper · Hermes

I loved the book actually! Yes, it was a bit anticlimactic and sugary-sweet, but I would have been PISSED if she had killed of Ron, Hermione, Harry, or Ginny.

JKR isn't the world's best writer, but I actually think her writing is pretty good. I think she has an incredible way of naming characters just perfectly and I can't put the books down once I get started. Her ability to keep readers engaged, devoted, and really excited over the course of 4,000 pages, in my opinion, speaks to her ability to create a great story.

halleybird · Hermes

emery- Stephen King is a great writer, actually. Dan Brown, not so much.

I agree with Blubirde about JK's writing ability. She doesn't have the precision of, say, Hemingway, but her characterization is fantastic. The books are technically children's lit, so it's natural that the sentences are fairly short and the vocabulary simplistic.

That said, I loved it. II thought Rowling did a great job integrating different elements from all of the previous books. I enjoyed the humanizing of Dumbledore, Petunia and Dudley, too, and the Lily/Snape love story actually explained a lot. I wish she'd done more with Malfoy, though. He was such a big character, especially in the early books, that I felt like something needed to happen with him -- he needed to move one way or the other. I thought I saw the beginning when he claimed not to recognize Harry at Malfoy Manor, but then he was back to his old tricks again later on.

I think there was quite a bit of deux ex machina going on, but that's part of all the books IMO. And I agree about the epilogue-- what was the point? We didn't really hear anything we didn't already know was going to happen. It does sound like it was written a long time ago. Was I the only one who thought Harry would end up as Headmaster at Hogwarts?

I didn't find it sugary-sweet at all. In fact, I got a little tired of everybody being killed off all the time.

dangergirl- the reason Harry didn't die is because Voldemort's wand wouldn't work against its rightful owner. So the only thing he did was kill the part of Harry that wasn't Harry -- Voldemort himself. I think that was the crying child thing.

ETA: can someone answer this for me? How did Neville get the Sword of Gryffindor to destroy Nagini? I thought the goblins took it?

-- Edited by halleybird at 18:50, 2007-07-31

Farrah · Marc Jacobs

Love, love, loved it!! I normally read my HPs really fast because I can't bear to put them down, but i took a whole week on this one. Partly to REALLY digest what was going on and partly because I did not want to admit that it was really coming to a close. I cried my eyes out when Dobby died (and when Harry was digging his grave). I also lost my mind when Harry was walking through the forest to his death. I was crying so hard I coudn't see through my tears sometimes. That is why I think JK Rowling is an amazing writer. She creates stories that people can enjoy and characters that we fall in love with. One thing that I liked about this particular book is that they left a lot of the British vernacular in it. Most of the books have been stripped of that piece of the stories, but for some reason they didn't do that with Book 7 and I am happy they made that choice.

Oh and Halleybird: not sure how Neville came up with Gryffindor's sword. I just chalked it up to another one of those times that it will just appear when one is worthy.

halleybird · Hermes

I bawled my eyes out during the forest part too, Farrah. And you're right about Gryffindor's sword. I always forget that Neville is a Gryffindor; he always seemed like more of a Hufflepuff to me.

(from the chat transcript Sephorablue posted):

Su: How did neville get the gryfindor sword, is there a link to the hat

J.K. Rowling: Yes, there is very definitely a link to the hat!

J.K. Rowling: Neville, most worthy Gryffindor, asked for help just as Harry did in the Chamber of secrets, and Gryffindors sword was transported into Gryffindors old hat

J.K. Rowling: the Sorting Hat was Gryffindors initially, as you know.

-- Edited by halleybird at 01:23, 2007-08-01

blubirde · Chanel

I have a question that I haven't seen answered anywhere yet (including JKR's chat although I could have missed it). How did the Death Eaters know where Harry, Hermione, and Ron apparated to right after the wedding? Any ideas?