STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

Mia · Kate Spade

dog owners PLEASE help me...

tara t · Marc Jacobs

not so much help, but i have a weenie dog that *used* to do the same thing. is your dog young? my dog has grown out of it. and i know what you mean when your dog 'screams'.

i used to live with a roomie who had a dog sometimes ( shared w/ girlfriend ) and my dog and his dog got along fine.

i moved out about 6 mths later, and my dog seriously turned insane with other dogs and kids! the kid part is really bad because it scares the crap out of both the dog and child.

now, my dog just runs away from other animals. he's stopped screaming and peeing, but is still scared out of his little weenie dog mind.

katya · BCBG

First, let me say I am not a dog expert, I just have 2 dogs of my own. They actually do make puppy valium. You need to go to the vet to get it. Next time you try to socialize her, try to give her a LITTLE bit of the pill (half or something - don't knock her out, just enough to make her mellow) before you leave. That may help to calm her down a bit.

Does she get along with your other dog? Also, talk to your vet and explain your prob; they may have some advice. Some dogs are just like that though; there may not be anything you can do about it. Is she fixed? If not, fixing a dog sometimes helps to calm them down. Maybe try obedience school; you could call a few schools, explain your prob, and maybe they have a class that could help you. I think Halleybird posted something on fashion hag about dogster (dog version of friendster); go there and ask someone. You might get more sound advice from some real dog people! Good luck with your dog!

Mia · Kate Spade

Tara - Yes, she is young, only 2. I've been told by a number of people that dachshunds (esp. the smooth coats, and she is one) can be spazzy.

Katya - I am SOOOO going to ask the vet about the doggie valium. I don't want to randomly drug her up but a little bit before an outing where I know she is going to be dealing with strange dogs/people might help. She is not fixed yet, I still haven't decided whether to breed her once or not. I do belong to Dogster so I will check that out and see if anyone has any advice - where I live doesn't help as it is quite an isolated, small community and there are no dog obediance classes that I know of locally. I would be there if there were!

Edit: She gets along perfectly with the other dog, they are buddies. If anything, she is the boss of my bigger dog, not the other way around.

-- Edited by Mia at 15:59, 2005-01-27

mckenke · BCBG

Does your dog only freak out on the leash? I found that my dog is more aggressive on the leash, but when I take him to the dog run he is fine. I mentioned this to an instructor when I was taking him agility class (I am a dork about my dog and took him to these classes) and she said that dogs often feel threatened on the leash because they are restrained and they have to show the other dog who is boss.

katya · BCBG

I just remembered something. My BF and I took a road trip 2 summers ago and took our older dog (the new one's only 1 yr old; she's the baby of our other dog). It was such a long trip, (we drove from Ohio to Oregon) we were worried she wouldn't last in a car that long. I was wary of giving her drugs, so I went to the little locally owned pet store and found a bottle of all-natural dog "valiums." They weren't actually valiums, they were some sort of herb, but they were supposed to calm dogs down and help to settle their stomachs on car trips. They worked pretty well for the trip, but I don't know if they will help your situation. They're worth a try if you don't wan to give her drugs. Good luck!

mckenke · BCBG

Along the lines of medication. My dog has seziures and before we had to put him on the prescription meds the vet recommended Rescue Remedy. It is a herbal supplement for humans, but you can give it to dogs and it is supposed to calm them down (you can get it at a health food store). It is 4 drops on the tongue (my dog refuses to open his mouth, so if you put it on his nose he will lick it off). My vet said that many of the valium type medications can cause seizures in dogs, but if your dog isn't prone to them then you don't have to worry.

Mia · Kate Spade

I am going to ask the vet about all of these remedies. I am a BIG freak about my dogs and I've got to be 100% sure of somehting like medication before I go ahead with it.

I have figured out what really gets her going. If we are somewhere crowded, or somewhere with a lot of people who are standing close to her, she is nervous but OK. It's when we are walking and she's sees someone approaching from far away - the whole time they get closer she just gets more and more antsy until she finally explodes into the screaming/freaking out thing as they get close. Usually if I see someone coming I pick her up and walk backwards (yeah, I know, I need to deal with this) so she can't see the person/dog approaching but today that didn't work because this guy's dogs were whining and barking (they were still very puppyish) and she heard them. It's visual with her, and it's a lot better if she's just 'surprised' by someone. In fact the fastest way to get her to shut up if I have company over is to hand her to whoever is over. She goes silent as soon as they are holding her. I think it's fear and also defensiveness about me - she doesn't like other people getting near me and will sometimes growl (although she has never bitten anyone or even acted like she was going to).

luckylily · Gucci

I can totally relate.

Our dog is fine with other dogs, but he is terrified of people he doesn't know really well. We rescued him when he was 2, so we don't know his history. We've taken him to many, many obedience classes, paid tons of money for medical tests to check of thyroid problems, and he's even met with a woman who has a Ph.D. in behavior. At this point, we've gotten him to the point that he can be around people, but if a stranger would try to pet him, he would freak and pee on himself.

Based on the submissive peeing, it seems like your dog is probably scared. I highly recommend a book called The Caustious Canine by Patricia McConnell. It has tons of great advise about how to get a dog better socialized to people and animals. Another good one is called Calming Signals, it is actually more of a pamphlet that describes behaviors you can do to signal to your dog that things are okay.

Usually this behavior pops up with dogs that weren't exposed to certain things within the first 7 or 8 weeks of their life. For example, if your dog never met a man early on, they'd be more likely to be afraid of men and it would be more difficult for them to accept men. However, some dogs just aren't wired right.

I would highly recommend against breeding a dog that had problems like the ones you are describing. Regardless of what you do, behavior is partially genetic, and I don't think those are traits that should be passed along in the gene pool.

halleybird · Hermes

Mia, my dog Halley (in my avatar) has the exact same reaction to other dogs (except she's 60 lbs and strong as shit - fun, huh?). She has been to a few different trainers, and no one can figure it out. She gets along fine with my other dog, but anytime she sees a dog (like, while we're walking, or out the window), she whines and cries and jumps and pulls on me. The only thing that has helped is giving her firm commands ("stay"), but it doesn't really help all that much.

I just keep her away from other dogs. She goes to play with my mom's dogs (she's fine with them since she's known them her whole life), and when we go on walks, we walk on the opposite side of the street from any other human being. If I see another dog, we turn and goo the opposite way.

ETA: she has been on puppy valium before, too ("Calmatol"). Didn't do a damn thing IMO.

-- Edited by halleybird at 18:24, 2005-01-27

Mia · Kate Spade

Halleybird, that must be a nightmare. I mean, Tinker is a pain in the ass but at least I don't have to worry she's going to bite or attack another dog/person (not saying your dog would but a 60lb dog is a much tougher prospect than 1 6;b. one) My strategy is basically the same as yours right now - avoid other dogs. I just wonder how that would work if I lived somewhere urban - it probably wouldn't. At all.

I will check out the book and pamphlet you mentioned, Lilykind.

As for breeding, the vet told me that Tinker would most likely have one puppy and possibly two (she's very tiny and the runt of the litter). I would keep it if she had one and if she had two, my parents would take the other one. Breeding her wouldn't be something I would do to make money or anything, and I would not give/sell puppies to anyone who wasn't either in my family or who I didn't know very, very well as a friend. I also wouldn't do it more than once. It probably won't happen anyway, because I've been reading about all the things that can go wrong and it scared me. Other than the spazziness with strangers she's an awesome dog and has a ton of personality. She's always making me laugh and being generally hilarious.

Edit: Halleybird - is your dog afraid when she acts like that? My sister's 55 lb. dog can get quite aggressive and growly with other dogs and it's definitely fear. She had a rough start in life and she still sort of reminds me of a 'street kid' - overly alert and always looking out for where the next attack is going to come from.

-- Edited by Mia at 19:15, 2005-01-27

RyanJ · Coach

When I read your post it was like I had written it myself. I have a mini wiener dog (Wills) too. He is insane. He is really great when he is at home, but a total monster when strangers come over or he sees another dog. We had a wiener dog before and he was a little crazy too, but no where near what Wills is. I can not take him anywhere because all he does is bark and freak out.

With all the said we have taken him to obedience classes and they actually helped. We had to put in a separate room away from all the other dogs for the first 3 weeks because the instructor could not talk over Wills barking. We also took him to aggression classes and these seem to help, but a few weeks after the classes ended he was back to his old ways because we didn’t really keep working with him.

A few things that we were told is that if the dog barks for attention that you are suppose to ignore them. Wills will jump and bark at you until you pick him up. The instructor said that picking him up just encourages him. They also told us that as horrible as it is we have to socialize him. I try to take him to the pet store once a week and walk him quite often. It was really bad the first month when I would take him out. He would just go crazy and people would stare at you like you are a moron. I don’t get embarrassed easily, but I do when I take him out. The more I take him out the better he gets. He does not act like I want him to, but he has gotten better. Unfortunately I think the barking just runs in the breed, but I am hoping I can control it a little bit.

We tried to give him Valium at the holiday because we have relatives that bring their dogs over. Our vet was really hesitant about doing it. I know all vets are different, but in my experience they would rather not.

Here is Wills!

halleybird · Hermes

quote:
Originally posted by: Mia
": Halleybird - is your dog afraid when she acts like that? My sister's 55 lb. dog can get quite aggressive and growly with other dogs and it's definitely fear. She had a rough start in life and she still sort of reminds me of a 'street kid' - overly alert and always looking out for where the next attack is going to come from. -- Edited by Mia at 19:15, 2005-01-27"

I think she is afraid, but mostly just nervous. She is the same way about cats. I don't think she'd ever attack one, though...she's had the opportunity and has never snapped or anything.

Actually, she just discovered that there are 2 dogs next door (we've been here two years...she's obviously quite perceptive), and spends her time outside running up and down the back fence crying.

She was a rescue dog - we got her at 5 months from a foster home. She had been beaten and starved by her previous owner and has always been a little weird. We also can't crate her or even put her in an enclosed room -- she flips out. We lived in an apt. one summer and tried to crate her. She actually chewed through the hard plastic of the crate (ripping up her gums in the process.)

She is the best dog, though. I am guessing if yours is still young and doesn't have the background mine has, she should get over it. Good luck!

blink · Coach

there is a dog msg board I used to go to when I was a new dog owner, www.idog.com. the posters there are fanatical dog enthusiasts, but very knowledgable. I believe that the author of "The Dog Whisperer" posts there occasionally too.

Mia · Kate Spade

Wow RyanJ they sound very similiar! I take Tinker to the pet store when I go as well - she used to freak out in stores (I take her as often as I can) but she is better now - it makes her nervous, and she trembles, but she is quiet and lets people pet her without flipping out. She is actually quite mellow when she's just with me but she's so high strung that any new situation just sets her off. I need to get her little tiny blinders or something for when we are on walks. ;) She is the same colour as your Wills - that red doxie shade.

Halleybird - My sister's dog tried to chew her way out of a wire (chain link) enclosure. That was a bloody mess (literally). She never tried that again. She's very attached to my sister.

Lorelei - I will check that board out, I was looking for somehting like that. Thanks.

alb · Marc Jacobs

Another mini weiner dog owner here. My dog kind of does the same thing when she's people with dogs approaching. She does this thing that sounds like your dog's scream--it is a cross b/w a bark and a cry. It's as if she is doing both at the same time. My hubby and I think it's b/c she's excited and wants to play, b/c she always quickly tried to run towards them. If they're across the street, she'll pull on her leash and try to dart right across the road! There is a dog next door to us, a huge German Shephard that always stays inside, and we can't hear him but I guess she can and she always barks frantically when we walk past their house. I think a lot of that can just be chalked up to the personality traits of weiner dogs (but yours may have been traumatized before being rescued). My dog doesn't really get scared of other dogs unless they are unusually large or menacing looking. She does get extremely frightened by the vacuum cleaner though.

I second the all natural valium suggestion. I have a friend that gives this stuff to his labs and he swears by it. It is all natural and kind of expensive but I forgot what it's called. I can get the name if you'd like--something like Serena?? You can buy it online. Another option is to try half of a Benadryl before you take her on walks. I've been told my our vet that Benadryl is completely safe to give dogs and is actually recommended when travelling with a dog. Hmm--that's all I have. I know that wasn't very helpful, but I know what you're going through--daccshunds (sorry, too lazy to look up sp) are soooo sweet and affectionate but also skiddish and high maintenance!

Mia · Kate Spade

Aw, it's too bad we don't live close to each other, we could have a sausage convention and let the little crazies get used to dogs their own size.

RyanJ · Coach

quote:
Originally posted by: Mia
"Aw, it's too bad we don't live close to each other, we could have a sausage convention and let the little crazies get used to dogs their own size. "

I would love to see a bunch of crazy weiner dogs going nuts together.

When you said that it reminded me of another thing we were told by a dog behaviorist (we were desperate for help). She said that we should start introducing Wills to dogs that are close to his size. He may feel threatened by dogs that are bigger than him. Which I found to be true. When my brother or aunt and uncle bring their dogs over Wills go crazy. Their dogs are both over 50lbs, but if little dogs come over to our house Wills gets use to them much quicker. He doesn’t seem to freak out quite as much for quite as long. He still freaks out, but to a lesser degree. I know it probably will be hard to find a supply of never ending little dogs, but I didn’t know if maybe you had friends or family w/ little dogs that you could hang out with. I know a few so I would tell them what the situation was and how crazy my dog was going to be. They would come over and we would walk around my neighborhood together.

They also said to socialize in a neutral place. If the dogs come to your house then Tinker may feel like she has to protect her house and protect you.

Mia · Kate Spade

Everyone here has big dogs. And Tinker is small even for a mini doxie (she is 6.5 lbs and is full grown). I try to take her out as much as possible - she is slightly better with people than she used to be but other dogs...oh, it's the end of the world when she sees another dog. She actually sits in front of the front window and goes nuts when another dog *walks by* our house. She crazee.

I am laughing thinking about them all running around together. I bet they would love it - they're actually very, very social with the people/dogs they're familiar with, aren't they?

alb · Marc Jacobs

quote:
Originally posted by: Mia
"Aw, it's too bad we don't live close to each other, we could have a sausage convention and let the little crazies get used to dogs their own size. "

I know! You guys & your babies could come to the local doggy happy hour with me & Sabine on Thursday nights in the summer! I'm so ready for warm weather so I can take her out more frequently--she doesn't like the cold temperatures (and she especially abhors snow).